GLOBAL WARMING - 'Chasing Ice'?

Historical insights & thoughts about the world we live in - and the social conditioning exerted upon us by past and current propaganda.
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by simonshack »

ICfreely wrote:astronomers and doctors wrote great medieval Jewish treatises, and Rav Kook supported Darwin...”
I bet he did - living up to his name, I s'pose ! :P

ICfreely wrote: and fasting for the climate [ :lol: ].
Oh no, no !! We've gotta stop them, alright! Fasting notoriously messes with your bowels - and causes very dangerous emissions!

Those clerics & rabbis haven't a clue - will they never learn from solid scientific studies ?... - such as : ... xstinktion
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by resolution » ... ment-win-a
Monckton: Harper defeat in Canada election will allow “world government” win at UN Paris climate meet

BRISBANE, Australia, October 18, 2015 (LifeSiteNews) – According to Lord Christopher Monckton, a former policy adviser to British Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, Monday's Canadian election will decide if Prime Minister Stephen Harper, whom he calls the last man standing against the establishment of a 'one world government', will remain against a deliberate international effort to remove him. The second last, Australia's Prime Minister Tony Abbott, was overthrown, as predicted by Monckton in 2014, in order to clear the way for this international scheme.

With Harper out of the way, warned Monckton, world governance will finally begin with a successful December, 2015 Paris Climate Conference. Another major factor for the Climate treaty’s likely success this time, after many past failures, is the unprecedented, strong public support of the Roman Catholic Church under Pope Francis.

The Harper Conservative government has consistently opposed these binding international agreements that impose dramatic limits on the sovereignty of nations in order to resolve still-much-disputed, environmentalist claims of dangerous man-induced climate change.

Organizers of the Paris summit are proclaiming that “for the first time in over 20 years of UN negotiations,” they “aim to achieve a legally binding and universal agreement on climate.” At risk, according to Monckton and many other critics of the “fraudulent” climate change movement, is democracy, its associated freedoms, and the Christian way of life worldwide.

In September 2014, Monckton spoke in Brisbane, detailing his claims of the fraud behind the global warming 'science'. Monckton exposed what he says are the true intentions of what has been presented to the world as a noble environmentalist cause that demands urgent action.

This concealed push for a one-world government began at the Copenhagen Climate Change Conference in 2009, with a treaty draft containing “The scheme for the new institutional arrangement under the Convention will be based on three basic pillars: government; facilitative mechanism; and financial mechanism …” (UNFCCC draft of the Copenhagen Treaty, Annex 1, Para. 38, 15 September 2009) (emphasis added) It was blocked by China. The Copenhagen conference also included an emphasis on population control as the final solution.

As Monckton points out, “This (environmental treaty) process has nothing to do with the weather. It has nothing to do with man's impact on the weather. It has everything to do with establishing the socialist international at the heart of the UN and making every nation bow the knee to this new dictatorship, and the climate is merely a fig leaf to cover what they are trying to do.”

Monckton recounted a conversation when Sir David King, William Hague's United Kingdom “climate change ambassador” was asked by the Environmentalist Committee of the House of Commons in May 2014 “whether all the nations of the world were in principle ready to sign their peoples rights away in such a treaty,” to which he replied “Oh yes, but there are two stand-outs. One is Canada, but don't worry about Canada. They've got an election in the spring of 2015 and we and the U.N. will make sure that the present government is removed.” Monckton recalled his absolute bluntness about the matter.

The other holdout was Australia which was in an arguably stronger position as there was no election until after the 2015 Paris Climate Change Conference. With Tony Abbott as leader there was no chance that Australia would be signing the treaty. In 2014, Abbott had taken the unusual step of sending an additional minister to accompany foreign minister Julie Bishop to ensure that she did not vote for the treaty at the 2014 Climate Change Conference in Lima.

Monckton warned of the need to protect Abbott and the danger from the Turnbull faction, in conjunction with the United Nations, doing their best to remove him ahead of this year’s Climate Change Conference.

In February this year, barely five months after Monckton's warning, Abbott survived a first attempt on his leadership from the Turnbull faction. However, incessant negative and biased media coverage influenced the perception of Turnbull by the Australian population, and hence depressed his polling figures. Consequently, a substantial number of government MPs became anxious with an election less than a year away. In September, as reported by LifeSiteNews, Abbott was replaced by Turnbull 54-44 in a leadership spill ballot.

The outcome of the Canadian election remains to be seen, but the aim of any behind the scenes involvement by the UN and other climate extremists would be to effect a change of government so that Canada's vote at the December climate conference will be changed.

Monckton has urged people to write to their MPs and ask them to ensure that any treaty draft or treaty that is signed has a clause added that enables a country “when it eventually comes off the Kool-aid and wakes up” to withdraw at a later date after giving sufficient notice. He provided a previously used example from Article 27 if the Kyoto protocol which Canada itself has used to withdraw from that treaty.

“At any time after three years from the date on which this Protocol has entered into force for a Party, that Party may withdraw from this Protocol by giving written notification to the Depositary.”

By default, the 2015 Paris treaty agreement will not have this. According to Monckton, we need to “make sure that the nations of the world are not locked into something which in due course they would very nearly all bitterly regret.”

See Sept. 18, 2015 full explanation by Lord Monckton about this issue via a Skype interview

full link:

See full length version of Monckton's September 2014 presentation below.

full link:

Mr. Monckton was Special Advisor to Margaret Thatcher as U.K. Prime Minister from 1982 to 1986. In 1986 he was among the first to advise the prime minister that “global warming” caused by carbon dioxide should be investigated. Two years later she set up the Hadley Centre for Forecasting: but she, like him, later changed her view. On leaving 10 Downing Street, he established a successful specialist consultancy company, giving technical advice to corporations and governments. His two articles on global warming in The Sunday Telegraph in November 2006 crashed its website after attracting 127,000 hits within two hours of publication.

A speech by Mr. Monckton to 1,000 citizens of St. Paul, Minnesota in October 2009, in which he drew public attention to a then little-known draft plan by the U.N. to establish an unelected world government at the (now-failed) climate summit at Copenhagen in December 2009, received 1,000,000 YouTube hits in a week – thought to be the fastest-ever YouTube platinum for a political speech. Some five million have now seen the presentation on various websites.
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by ICfreely »

Here’s some more brimstone & hellfire nonsense from the high priests of hot air.
Climate Change Dialogue May Be Missing The Voice Of Islamic Leaders
12/01/2012 - Associated Press – Michael Casey and Karl Ritter

World religions are seeking a more active role in climate change and sustainability issues. The Interfaith Declaration on Climate Change project – endorsed by Christianity, Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism and Sikhism – was a regular presence at the U.N. climate talks in Copenhagen in 2009, while the Dalai Lama has repeatedly called on governments to take climate change more seriously. Religious leaders have launched a movement known as “green religion” or “eco-theology. With groups like Evangelical Environmental Network endorsing clean energy and calling on people to consume less. ... 22211.html
Climate Change: A Call for Personal Changes
By Imam Shabir Ally

The reality of climate change calls for a re-evaluation of our actions and a redirection of our energies towards the reduction or possible reversal of the looming environmental crisis. Religious leaders are challenged to look into their traditions for any inspiration that could guide us towards averting this global disaster. This new demand on old traditions forces us to look creatively at the world’s religious heritage and reinterpret or reapply sacred texts and principles to our present problem.

A Call for Change

We have caused corruption on land and sea, and it is up to us to mend our ways. Our present crisis calls on religious leaders to find faith-based messages that will inspire the faithful towards a heightened environmental awareness. We have seen that there is ample content in the sacred traditions of Islam to meet this need. What remains to be seen is the extent to which we will rally to this call for personal change. ... and-islam/
:puke: :puke:
Global Warming and Islam
The problem of global warming is regarded as one of the most serious environmental problems of our time, concerning which experts have held many conferences and published many articles about its dire consequences. These experts attribute this rise in temperature to the accumulation of gases in the atmosphere that is caused by factories, power stations and car emissions, which has led to a rise in air temperature and ocean temperature, which threatens to melt the ice-caps and cause flooding of land, which is expected to change the features of some countries completely and to change the climate of vast areas on earth.

We could not find anything about this in the Qur’aan and Sunnah, apart from one hadeeth which some scholars who are specialized in sharee’ah and environmental sciences say has to do with this topic, and some of the most prominent specialists in the world agreed with them, which is that the Arabian Peninsula will again become meadows and rivers. They attribute that to a complete change in the earth’s climate and the melting of the Arctic ice cap due to global warming. ... and-islam/
:puke: :puke: :puke:
The ‘green religion’ is g-d’s will - the eco-theological ‘experts’ have spoken!
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by ICfreely »

It should come as no surprise that the Rothschilds are knee deep in the AGW scam. A few years ago they acquired a controlling interest in the world’s leading provider of interactive weather graphics and data services.
Even the Rothschilds Are Weather Obsessed
January 31, 2011

Evelyn de Rothschild and Lynn Forester de Rothschild said they are buying a majority stake in weather-data service Weather Central L.P., marking a significant expansion of the Rothschilds’ investments into media and information. ... r-central/

David Mayer de Rothschild has apparently been tasked with advancing this sector of his family’s fraud. Here’s a clip of Dave using NASA fakery to convert the masses to the ‘green religion.’

David de Rothschild Presenting at The Weather Company Climate Conversation

full link:

So in 1963 he [Buckminster Fuller] basically described our planet as ‘Spaceship Earth’…It was five years before that incredible image of our planet [?] earthrise, when the guys [?] Apollo mission going out to the moon were suddenly like, ‘Oh what’s back there? Oh shit there’s Earth.’ Right? And it became one of the most amazing images that we’ve seen. Fifty years ago! And he, he came up with this phrase (‘Spaceship Earth’), he coined it, but he also said we’re not going to be able to live on this Earth (or this spaceship), not for much longer. Fifty years ago! Unless we see our fate is common. It has to be everybody or nobody. Fifty years ago!

In July NASA put this image out of our home, that’s us [pointing to a NASA image]. This was taken from 900 million miles away – 1.4 billion kilometers away. Imagine that! Isn’t that crazy that we actually have the capacity to take a photograph of us from over a billion kilometers away. That’s insane!
Insane, indeed!
And on one side, it’s scary as shit [ :ph34r: ] because you look at it and you’re like, ‘that’s us! We really are a spaceship. There’s no escape.’ And on the other side is inspiring and amazing that we, as humans, have understood and created the capacity to do that. It shows you the, you know, combined intelligence that we can create amazing things if we work together.
Speaking of ‘there’s no escape,’ Here’s a segment of Dave’s ‘contentious debate’ with Alex ‘Prison Planet’ Jones:
David de Rothschild on Alex Jones Show (2/4)

full link:
DR to AJ: You’re not denying, you’re not denying that cli… Are you denying that climate change exists? [ :rolleyes: ]

Alex’s over-the-top clownish tirade is meant to discredit legit skeptics thereby lending credence to Dave’s nonsense. He also cites NASA in his arguments against Dave so that pretty much says it all. With regards to Buckminster Fuller:

R. Buckminster Fuller

"For the first time in history it is now possible to take care of everybody at a higher standard of living than any have ever known. Only ten years agao [sic] the 'more with less' technology reached the point where this could be done. All humanity now has the option of becoming enduringly successful." - Buckminster Fuller, 1980.

R. Buckminster Fuller, known by his friends as "Bucky", has undeniably been one of the key innovators in the 20th century. He is known as a philosopher, thinker, visionary, inventor, architect, engineer, mathematician, poet, cosmologist, and more.

Buckminster Fuller was probably one of the first futurists and global thinkers. He is the one who coined the term "Spaceship Earth", and his work has inspired and paved the way for many who came after him.

This is the Dymaxion Map of the world, developed by Fuller as the first world projection to show the continents on a flat surface without visible distortion. Furthermore, this view shows the earth as being essentially one island in one ocean.

Bucky was the person most responsible for making Synergy a common term. Much of his work was about exploring and creating synergy. He found synergy to be a basic principle of all interactive systems. He developed a subject called Synergetics, a "Geometry of Thinking".

Fuller is the inventor of the Geodesic dome, and was a pioneer in utilizing basic geometical shapes in design.
A key goal for Buckminster Fuller was the development of what he called "Comprehensive Anticipatory Design Science", which is the attempt to anticipate and solve humanity's major problems by providing "more and more life support for everybody, with less and less resources."

Fuller routinely demonstrated his ideas in what he called "artifacts", tangible prototypes or models of designs and principles.

Comprehensive Anticipatory Design Science = Climate Change doomsday CGI pseudoscience.

Ol’ Bucky also influenced Disney’s Epcot Center:

Disney Park History: Spaceship Earth

The 18-story geodesic sphere at the head of Epcot theme park houses a ride that is also called Spaceship Earth, where guests experience a trip through time using the Omnimover system. The ride shows guests how advancements in human communication have helped to create the future one step at a time. The attraction involves a timeline from the origins of prehistoric man to the dawn of the 21st century, where guests can then create a future for themselves.

The structure was designed with the help of science fiction writer Ray Bradbury [of Star Trek fame], who also helped write the original storyline for the attraction.

The term 'Spaceship Earth' was coined by Buckminster Fuller, who also developed the structural mathematics of the geodesic dome.

The structure is similar in texture to the United States pavilion from Expo 67 in Montreal, but unlike that structure, Spaceship Earth is a complete sphere, supported on legs. The structure's exterior is comparable to that of a large golf ball. (below)

Geometrically, Spaceship Earth is a derivative of a pentakis dodecahedron, with each of the 60 isosceles triangle faces divided into 16 smaller equilateral triangles (with a bit of fudging to make it rounder). Each of those 960 flat panels is sub-divided into four triangles, each of which is divided into three isosceles triangles to form each point. In theory, there are 11,520 total isosceles triangles forming 3840 points. In reality, some of those triangles are partially or fully nonexistent due to supports and doors; there are actually only 11,324 of them, with 954 partial or full flat panels.

As with many WDW attractions, Spaceship Earth has had sponsors. All 3 have been communications companies, which fit the the 'communication and collaboration through time' theme of the ride. The first sponsor was Bell Systems (1982-1984), and then it changed to AT&T (1984-2004) with the break up off the 'Bell's' in the '80's, and Siemens AG (2005-present) picked up sponsorship. With each change of sponsor (plus once in 1994) the ride has been renovated, slightly updated, and received new narration and music.

Rothschild + Disney + communications behemoths + sci-fi writers + Bucky = A new world religion

United Church of God: Our Amazing Spaceship Earth
Posted on Jan 16, 2011

Have you ever dreamed of traveling through space? The prospects sound exciting to most people.
Amazingly, we are already traveling through space—but without being aware of it! Our planet can rightly be compared to a giant spacecraft carrying more than 6 billion people and billions more animals and plants. American scientist Buckminster Fuller coined the fitting term “Spaceship Earth” to describe our planet.

We are truly hurtling through space on this giant spacecraft called Earth—at the incredible speed of 66,600 miles per hour! This is far faster than man’s speediest aircraft. At the same time, this space vehicle is spinning at 1,000 miles per hour at the equator. Every year we complete an entire circuit around the sun—a journey of more than half a billion miles!

Yet perhaps the most amazing aspect of our voyage is that we don’t feel the trip at all. Certainly as we travel in a car at 50 miles per hour, we can sense the velocity and see the scenery go by. But the paradox is, once we get out of the car and sit down, everything on the ground seems at rest—yet we are still traveling at an incredible speed through space. ... ship-earth
Sure we are.

According to the United Church of ‘God,’ our God-given senses are not to be trusted. Its purported mission is to ‘preach the gospel of Jesus Christ and the Kingdom of God in all the world, make disciples in all nations and care for those disciples.’

Come to think of it, Dave and Jesus do share an uncanny resemblance:

David de Rothschild - Plastic Jesus?

full link:
Critical Mass
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by Critical Mass »

I thought I'd analyse the sources for the claims made in the following article:

Embarrassing Predictions Plague the Global-Warming Industry

No particular reason why I picked this article... I found it at random &, heck, it's shorter than this one.

Alleged prediction
It is now pretty clearly agreed that the CO2 content [in the atmosphere] will rise 25% by 2000. This could increase the average temperature near the earth’s surface by 7 degrees Fahrenheit. This in turn could raise the level of the sea by 10 feet. Goodbye New York. Goodbye Washington, for that matter.- - Presidential advisor Daniel Moynihan 1969
It appears Moynihan did indeed claim such a thing as it's here in the Nixon library... ... l10/56.pdf

...of course he did use the word "could" so I suppose we 'could' let it slide.

Note: continuing to read this post could lead to you spontaneously combusting.

Alleged prediction
Move Where (to escape the cold)? The Brutal Buffalo (NY) winter might be common all over the United States. Climate experts believe the next Ice Age is on its way. According to recent evidence, it could come sooner than anyone expected. - In Search of - “The Coming Ice Age” 1978
Indeed this was claimed in the Leonard Nimoy narrated documentary.

Alleged prediction
In New York City by 2008 The West Side Highway [which runs along the Hudson River] will be under water. And there will be tape across the windows across the street because of high winds. And the same birds won’t be there. The trees in the median strip will change. There will be more police cars. Why? Well, you know what happens to crime when the heat goes up... Under the greenhouse effect, extreme weather increases. Depending on where you are in terms of the hydrological cycle, you get more of whatever you’re prone to get. New York can get droughts, the droughts can get more severe and you’ll have signs in restaurants saying “Water by request only.” - James Hansen Grist Magazine June 1988
There are, nowadays, various competing theories on the context in which James Hansen said this or whether he meant 2028 rather than 2008 (no-one denies he made the claim).

Here’s a 2001 Salon article in which the claims are discussed & promoted.

It should be noted that James Hansen is alleged to have 'edited' the 1930's to help promote 'global warming'.

Alleged prediction
‘New York will probably be like Florida 15 years from now,’ - St. Louis Post-Dispatch Sept. 17, 1989
It appears the claim was made however the source article seems to be a silly one about fashion predictions.

Alleged prediction
In 1971, another global-cooling alarmist, Stanford University professor Paul Ehrlich said “By the year 2000 the United Kingdom will be simply a small group of impoverished islands, inhabited by some 70 million hungry people,”
I, naively, assumed this would turn out to be a falsely attributed claim... Nope it’s fully admitted & even features in his wiki article. The claim is discussed in this 1971 ‘New Scientist’ magazine.

Alleged prediction
The 2005 UNEP predictions claimed that, by 2010 some 50 million “climate refugees in ”the Caribbean and low-lying Pacific islands, would be frantically fleeing from those regions of the globe. However, not only did the areas in question fail to produce a single “climate refugee,” by 2010, population levels for those regions were actually still soaring.
There appears to be no way to verify this as the report has been memory-holed & just leads to a load of 404’s.

Certainly however UNEP were claiming at the time that climate refugees existed... on Vanuatu.

However come 2015 and EVEN the MSM (& IPCC) show some (limited) scepticism towards such claims...
IPCC wrote:However it is also likely—in other words there is a 66 per cent to 100 per cent probability—that overall there will be either a decrease or essentially no change in the number of tropical cyclones.
Alleged prediction
On June 30, 1989, the Associated Press ran an article headlined: “UN Official Predicts Disaster, Says Greenhouse Effect Could Wipe Some Nations Off Map.” In the piece, the director of the UNEP’s New York office was quoted as claiming that “entire nations could be wiped off the face of the earth by rising sea levels if global warming is not reversed by the year 2000.
Sigh... This incredible claim (made by a Noel Brown) is still in the AP archives.

I think we 'could' call it utter bullshit.

Alleged prediction
In its final 2007 report, widely considered the “gospel” of “settled” climate “science,” the UN IPCC suggested that Himalayan glaciers could melt by 2035 or sooner. It turns out the wild assertion was lifted from World Wildlife Fund propaganda literature. The IPCC recanted the claim after initially defending it.
Hmmm we have a "could" again... certainly the claim was made & then retracted.

However it far predates WWF propaganda. Here’s a 1999 ‘New Scientist’ promo featuring the prediction.

Alleged prediction
March 2000, for example, “senior research scientist” David Viner, working at the time for the Climatic Research Unit (CRU) at the University of East Anglia, told the U.K. Independent that within “a few years,” snowfall would become “a very rare and exciting event” in Britain. “Children just aren’t going to know what snow is,” he was quoted as claiming in the article, headlined “Snowfalls are now just a thing of the past.” The very next year, snowfall across the United Kingdom increased by more than 50 percent. By December of 2009, London saw its heaviest levels of snowfall in two decades. In 2010, the coldest U.K. winter since records began a century ago blanketed the islands with snow.
Geez... Yes he apparently did say that UK children “just aren’t going to know what snow is”.

The actual link to this story has been memory-holed however, and as is often the case, wayback machine provides an invaluable service for media skeptics.

Alleged prediction
In early 2004, the CRU’s Viner and other self-styled “experts” warned that skiing in Scotland would soon become just a memory, thanks to alleged global warming. Yet in 2013, too much snow kept many Scottish resorts closed. By 2014, the BBC, citing experts, reported that the Scottish hills had more snow than at any point in seven decades.
This appears to be not entirely accurate.

The alarmist propaganda piece actually states...
With the pace of global warming increasing, some climate change experts predict that the Scottish ski industry will cease to exist within 20 years.
Who those “some climate change ‘experts’” were was left to the readers imaginations.

Alleged prediction
White House Science “Czar” John Holdren. “A growing body of evidence suggests that the kind of extreme cold being experienced by much of the United States as we speak is a pattern we can expect to see with increasing frequency, as global warming continues,” he claimed. Holdren warned decades ago that human CO2 emissions would lead to a billion deaths due to global warming-fueled global cooling — yes, cooling, which he said would lead to a new ice age by 2020.
Again there appears to be some debate for whether or not he claimed such a thing. Some say he didn’t, some say he did.

Certainly though there is no doubt that Paul R. Ehrlich repeatedly made such claims* in books that Holdren co-wrote.

* Warning the above is a needlessly long if vaguely interesting article. I would summarize it as...

"Doomsayers repeatedly shown to be wrong & then they lose a bet with an economist. Doomsayers still affirm that they’re correct & that we’re all still doomed"

Alleged prediction
Princeton professor and lead UN IPCC author Michael Oppenheimer, made some dramatic predictions in 1990 while working as “chief scientist” for the Environmental Defense Fund. By 1995, he said then, the “greenhouse effect” would be “desolating the heartlands of North America and Eurasia with horrific drought, causing crop failures and food riots.”
There appears to be no doubt he made these predictions in his 1990 magnum opus “Dead Heat” & was apparently interviewed by FOX news regarding them... Oppenheimer remained unrepentant.
[By 1996] The Platte River of Nebraska would be dry, while a continent-wide black blizzard of prairie topsoil will stop traffic on interstates, strip paint from houses and shut down computers." Michael Oppenheimer, published in "Dead Heat," St. Martin's Press, 1990.

Oppenheimer told that he was trying to illustrate one possible outcome of failing to curb emissions, not making a specific prediction. He added that the gist of his story had in fact come true, even if the events had not occurred in the U.S.

"On the whole I would stand by these predictions -- not predictions, sorry, scenarios -- as having at least in a general way actually come true," he said. "There's been extensive drought, devastating drought, in significant parts of the world. The fraction of the world that's in drought has increased over that period."
This 'Dead Heat' horror novel must be an awesome read. It even managed to attract some limp-wristed academic ‘criticism’ at the time of its release...
STEPHEN JAY GOULD wrote: Michael Oppenheimer and Robert Boyle's ''Dead Heat'' (on global warming) does not insulate itself sufficiently from the heat of the hype surrounding the subject
Geez... don't pull your punches Steve.

Myself I prefer the modern day Amazon reviews...
This one time bible of the activist AGW movement quickly earned a place in the dust bin of useless information.
As a scientific source, this book's predictions for the future (now the past) are simply incorrect. However, for those who like earth science-fiction, this work has humorous entertainment value. The authors use an abundance of emotional, dire sounding adjectives which makes the reading even more enjoyable. Similar to the black & white science fiction movies made during the atomic scares of the 1950's, this book will provide some black and white evidence about the hysteria that substitutes for scientific method. In fact, the experience is very much like watching a B-grade horror movie with poorly constructed giant spiders or ray-gun equipped, maniac robots made from trash can lids. If you understand what real science is about and need a good laugh, the predictions (and the explanations used to back them up) are really worth reading. Just don't use this book as a source for your science class, research paper.
Alleged prediction
In 2007, 2008, and 2009, Al Gore, the high priest for a movement described by critics as the “climate cult,” publicly warned that the North Pole would be “ice-free” in the summer by around 2013 because of alleged “man-made global warming.”  Gore said during some of the summer months, Arctic ice could be completely ice-free within the next five to seven years,” Gore claimed in 2009. “We will find out.” Yes, we have found out. Contrary to the predictions by Gore and fellow alarmists, satellite data showed that Arctic ice volume as of summer of 2013 had actually expanded more than 50 percent over 2012 levels. In fact, during October 2013, sea-ice levels grew at the fastest pace since records began in 1979.
There's no doubt he said such things however he seems to use so many qualifiers one wonders if it even counts as a ‘prediction’.

Here’s a BBC story from 2007 about the possible ‘Ice free’ summers by 2013

It should be noted that ‘Ice free’ does not mean what one would imagine so even those scientists are not claiming our current ice age is about to end.

So all in all it appears true that the political & (allegedly) scientific establishments have made a number of absurd doomsday predictions over the years. These have, unsurprisingly, not panned out but the doom-sayers almost universally remain unrepentant & in most cases seem to claim their predictions were mostly accurate.

It's an interesting conundrum the nutwork faces here... on the one hand climate, by it's very nature, is a long term process.

On the other hand few are going to agree to a massive increase in taxes & Government control over their lives to "Stop the sun dying!"
"We only have five billion years* to act!"
"Will nobody think of the children!"

So it appears to be a tactical agreement that dire, near-term, catastrophic predictions will be made even though most scientists surely know they're complete bullshit. These predictions help drive home the 'need for change' & therefore are probably seen as being 'for the greater good'.

When people point out that those predictions have failed to occur then the doom-sayers merely 'kick the can down the road' or just make entirely new predictions.

Rinse & repeat.

Looking at all this one wonders about the modern day predictions we see being pushed by our media.

Are Saltwater crocodiles really in danger?

Will Malaria really spread**?

Will we have lakes in the future?

Will humanity survive?

How many hundreds of millions of children will really die?

* As per current models

** And if it does will that be due to Climate change... Malaria used to be a big deal in the Netherlands
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by omaxsteve »

That's what I call "journalism". Extremely well researched and very well written expose. This article should be mandatory reading, on the front page of every newspaper in the world. Like when they publish a correction for a wrong price in an advertisement in the following day's paper.

Magnificent work, CM!


Steve O.
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by pov603 »

Very thought provoking.
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by arc300 »

I will now willingly open myself to accusations being a scurrilous perpetrator of "link and run" type posting.

I will unashamedly post a link yet not comment on it.

And I will make each sentence a paragraph.

Like this.

I do this because I cannot hope to make any comment that is not said better in the article I'm linking to and, perhaps rather arrogantly, I will say that no person on Earth, whether a believer or non-believer, can claim to understand the question of Anthropogenic Global Warming without reading the Climategate emails and understanding the background 'climate' within which this anti-scientific nonsense was constructed.

The article exposes the complete lack of scientific validity regarding the "man made global warming" hypothesis, and it does so through the words of the so-called climate scientists themselves, via the 'Climategate' emails, which, I am sure, everybody reading this is at least vaguely familiar with.

Read it and fucking weep: ... emails.pdf
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by burningame »

arc300 wrote:I will now willingly open myself to accusations being a scurrilous perpetrator of "link and run" type posting...Read it and fucking weep: ... emails.pdf
Thanks arc300, I feel sure nobody here minds in this instance. This is ammunition.

Having read a few of the emails I would say this is a good example of what I (and maybe jumpy64) would call "JPM science", seemingly our new paradigm. By the way, I didn't say Jew, but JPM, since we are having such trouble defining the culprits.

Thank you for getting this further out in the open.
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by Seneca »

arc300 wrote:I will now willingly open myself to accusations being a scurrilous perpetrator of "link and run" type posting...Read it and fucking weep: ... emails.pdf
I wondered if Climategate has had any effects on the "scientists" that were exposed:
Mike Mann: lead player in the United States
Phil Jones: lead player in the United Kingdom
Tom Wigley: older player who becomes increasingly worried about the unfolding scandal
Keith Briffa: older player whose blunders lead the others to all but abandon him
Ben Santer: dangerously arrogant and naive young player in the United States
Was anyone fired? Has anyone resigned? Were funds reallocated?
Or did they perhaps get a promotion?

I looked them up myself, the only consequence I found was for Phil Jones: according to wikipedia
He temporarily stepped aside from Director of the CRU in November 2009 following a controversy over e-mails which were taken and published by person(s) unknown.[10] The House of Commons' Science and Technology Select Committee inquiry concluded that there was no case against Jones for him to answer, and said he should be reinstated in his post.[11] He was reinstated in July 2010 with the newly created role of Director of Research, after a further review led by Sir Muir Russell found no fault with the "rigour and honesty as scientists" of Jones and his colleagues, although finding that the CRU scientists had not embraced the "spirit of openness" of the UK Freedom of Information Act. The university said that the new position was not a demotion and would enable Jones to concentrate on research and "reduce his responsibilities for administration."
This could suggest that a new Director had been appointed and Phil is working under him/her. But I don't see any evidence for this. At the website of CRU he is listed at the top position as the only Director. So no mention of a new Director while previous Directors (not including Phil Jones) are listed at the bottom. So I agree that this is not a demotion.

Michael Mann, responsible for the famous hockey stick graph has been rewarded for his work:
In 2012, he was elected a Fellow of the American Geophysical Union[2] and awarded the Hans Oeschger Medal of the European Geosciences Union for "his significant contributions to understanding decadal-centennial scale climate change over the last two millennia and for pioneering techniques to synthesize patterns and northern hemispheric time series of past climate using proxy data reconstructions."[3][63]

Following election by the American Meteorological Society he became a new Fellow of the society in 2013.[68] In January 2013 he was designated with the status of distinguished professor in Penn State's College of Earth and Mineral Sciences.[69]

In September 2013, Mann was named by Bloomberg Markets in its third annual list of the "50 Most Influential" people, included in a group of "thinkers" with reference to his work with other scientists on the hockey stick graph, his responses on the RealClimate blog "to climate change deniers", and his book publications. Later that month, he received the National Wildlife Federation's National Conservation Achievement Award for Science.

On 28 April 2014 the National Center for Science Education announced that its first annual Friend of the Planet award had been presented to Mann and Richard Alley.
So was Ben Santer.
In 2011, Santer was elected as a fellow of the American Geophysical Union and as a member of the National Academy of Sciences.
Critical Mass
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by Critical Mass »

Seneca wrote:I wondered if Climategate has had any effects on the "scientists" that were exposed
I'm still going through the emails (only up to the year 2005 although even the first few emails were enough to make me feel distinctly queasy) however I too wondered about this.

I'll also be looking into the people behind the "eight independent reviews" who exonerated these 'scientists'.

One interesting titbit is that Jones claimed he considered suicide because of the release of these emails. I highly doubt the claim was an honest one but, even so, let's take it at face value.

He considered suicide because his work email account got hacked. Nothing about his private life was revealed during this 'scandal'... only his work emails.

Does that make sense in any conceivable way?

Would anybody reading this post ever consider suicide if their work account was hacked & released to the world?

If anyone anywhere answers yes to that question I'd be seriously interested to know what they do to 'make a living'.
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by arc300 »

Critical Mass wrote:

He considered suicide because his work email account got hacked.
The words "hacked" and "stolen" were (and probably still are) inserted into every MSM soundbite dealing with the emails. There is no evidence that the emails were hacked or stolen, and the investigation into the "crime" has been closed because the police have run out of time and

" [...] do not have a realistic prospect of identifying the offender or offenders",

which is, I believe, just a weasly way of saying that they don't even know if a crime has been committed. Yet it is still reported as fact that they were indeed "stolen" by "offenders"source: ... gate-hack/

An added level of nefariousness was added to the media distraction campaign by the suggestion that, because the "hack" was so sophisticated, no evidence of the alleged hack could be found, and so it must have been done by an intelligence agency ... probably the Russians. Scary stuff. (See this article from the Telegraph, "Climategate emails 'stolen by foreign spies'" link: ... spies.html

It seems that there is an equal likelihood that the emails were actually leaked by an internal whistleblower, but this has been ruled out because, well, the police haven't been able to identify any whistleblowers in the CRU, therefore there WERE no whistleblowers, and therefore the emails were stolen. Simple, really. I should have had more faith in the scientists and the government.
Critical Mass
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by Critical Mass »

arc300 wrote:The words "hacked" and "stolen" were (and probably still are) inserted into every MSM soundbite dealing with the emails.
I've just finished the emails... I must admit I'm pretty shocked by it all.

This is Cluesforum we all know stuff like this is, and has been, going on in the 'Scientific' world... yet there's a difference between knowing something on an intellectual level & actually reading it in black & white in the perps own words.

The behaviour of this gang (the only word I will use to describe such individuals from now on) is patently abhorrent... the insane twisting of the 'peer-review' process into a circle jerk of 'like minded' individuals, the hilarious personal selection of 'awards', the frenzied blacklisting of individuals responsible for even the merest 'criticisms', the bullying, the toadying, the sneakiness & cowardice, the madness of how this gang somehow ended up 'owning' publicly funded data being used to manipulate public policy, the amateurish understanding of the scientific method or even their own supposed 'field of expertise'.

I'll need some time to fully digest it all.

What is truly interesting to me though is that if this gang were entirely exonerated by 'eight independent reviews' then this strongly implies that such gang behaviour is not unusual within 'the scientific world'.

Yes arc300 you are right I was wrong to use the term 'hacked'. I was not aware the most likely source of the emails was a whistle-blower or perhaps even an accidental 'premature release' due to all the FOIA requests they had been getting.

Additionally you are right that 'hacked' is still used in contemporary mainstream reports that mention the 'scandal' (Here's one from last month for instance).


It seems to me that there is very little discussion of John Costella's book. If you google "The Climategate Files" & "John Costella" I get a little over a thousand hits. For comparison "September Clues" & "Simon Shack" receives ten times as many hits.
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by Apache »

Critical Mass wrote:He considered suicide because his work email account got hacked. Nothing about his private life was revealed during this 'scandal'... only his work emails.
I've started looking into this as well. Apparently he claims he got death threats and that's what made him feel suicidal. ... ntist.html
High-profile climate scientists have notoriously received death threats, especially since the backlash against global warming reached a fever pitch in the wake of so-called ClimateGate. Michael Mann, a climatologist behind the famed 'hockey stick' graph, and Phil Jones, head researcher at the Climate Research Unit at the University of East Anglia, have both notably said they're regularly sent some chilling messages.
There is a link to a pdf of the "death threat" emails on that page, which I've glanced at and don't find at all credible. ... limategate
The scientists say the threats have increased since the furore over leaked emails from the University of East Anglia began last November, and a sample of the hate mail sent in recent months and seen by the Guardian reveals the scale and vitriolic tone of the abuse.

The problem appears less severe in the UK but, Professor Phil Jones, the UEA scientist at the centre of the hacked email controversy, revealed in February he had been receiving two death threats a week and had contemplated suicide. "People said I should go and kill myself," he said. "They said that they knew where I lived. They were coming from all over the world."
Steve Schneider, IPCC Stanford Uni wonk, who died in 2010 also claimed this:
Schneider said the FBI had taken an interest earlier this year when his name appeared on a "death list" on a neo-Nazi website alongside other climate scientists with apparent Jewish ancestry. But, to date, no action has been taken.

"The effect on me has been tremendous," said Schneider. "Some of these people are mentally imbalanced. They are invariably gun-toting rightwingers. What do I do? Learn to shoot a Magnum? Wear a bullet-proof jacket? I have now had extra alarms fitted at my home and my address is unlisted. I get scared that we're now in a new Weimar republic where people are prepared to listen to what amounts to Hitlerian lies about climate scientists."
Schneider invoking Godwin's Law in record time. :rolleyes:
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Re: Global warming - 'Chasing Ice'?

Unread post by Nobalai »

KingMinusHead wrote: It occurred to me that this footage appeared somewhat 'interesting'. It struck me as having quite a 'layered' feel, with so much 'dramatic movement' and a kind of 'artificial flow'.
Really fascinating to try and find CGI clues or other oddities


Trying to find concrete evidence of CGI isn't entirely easy although I immediately agree something feels "off" especially considering the oddities section I'll elaborate on more below (separate from CGI analysis)


1) In the above footage (~3m:12s) we see one of the ice chunks sink at a linear speed. Almost looks like a 3D model prop with a tween. At the same time other ice is floating. I can understand some scenarios in which, as ice breaks from a single tremendous chunk, some pieces will sink and others will float as they find an equilibrium buoyancy force but something about this particular linear rate of speed feels off.


2) 3:22 above is even more potentially indicative of CGI. There are two clues.

For clue 2A watch the darker blue ice berg (middle left, HD youtube video suggested but gif supplied anyway) sink downwards, crumble (in rather strange fashion) and seemingly immediately stop with no oscillation or net visual result (remembering that for every force there is an equal and opposite reaction, and for an iceberg so massive to just ... stop, I'd certainly expect a different result.) It's even worse when you hear what seemingly sounds like drum noises and sound FX dubbed onto the clip in that moment. It sounds something like a rumbling timpani roll and then a door closing(?), which happens at the precise moment the dark blue ice berg comes to a halt, and for that reason I believe it was intended to be associated with that part of the imagery. It all comes off as really flaky though, when, as KingMinusHead points out, you are really paying attention.

For clue 2B, you'll need to open the source video and view in HD, focusing on what appears to be snow dust as it wafts to the right and upwards. It appears for around 3-4 seconds in the middle left of the screen at 3m:22. Perhaps some other eyes would help in confirming, but it seems to render at a different frame rate than the rest of the scene (in my approximation, about 1/2 the framerate)


1) I felt the phone call to start off the video and calving was rather cinema-like; a forced humanization of the rather terribly boring task of waiting for ice to supposedly melt.

"I'm on the phone with Jim on one of our regular check-ins." establishes that they must have been waiting a long time.

"Things are fairly well set up here, we've got some continuous time lapse going." - why the hell does Jim not already know things are fairly set up well and they are filming continuous time lapse? I assume he's either a boss or is funding this noble mission. Does he really need to hear this crap? And if indeed, this is a regular check in, why this needs to be re-established is beyond me.

It's also a rather stunning coincidence that the short phone call happened at the precise moment the money shot was beginning; not a moment too soon or late (supposedly lasted 75 minutes.) It was simply 10 seconds before the calving began. Perfect movie script....? You decide.

2) The clip at 48 seconds is also really weird. Why the hell are they video taping the videographer? By the hand-held nature of that 2 second clip, I am only more perplexed as to imagine the circumstance in which it was being recorded. Was the second person looking at the damn awe inspiring ice calving or not?
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