Murder of Italian politician Aldo Moro - what was it really?

[brianv]

I guess my "vaffanculo" won't cut it then!

[simonshack]

I guess my "vaffanculo" won't cut it then!

On the contrary, Brian...

That is the exact word I proffered when I realized tonight how integrally the Italian newsmedia were (and are) implicated with the Moro murder.

To our Italian members, please DO watch the entire morning's Italian TV broadcasts of May 9 1978 (the day Moro's body was reportedly found in a red Renault 4 in Via Caetani):

PART2 (already embedded in previous page):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DV9V7R6F2pM

PART3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fw_DiBOqMWg

PART4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2RiDHFCjqc&NR=1

[nonhocapito]

@nonhocapito

what about a drink at Le Bain BAR Via delle Botteghe Oscure, 33?

ciao

Hehe - I'll be joining you if Nonho can make it. Do you mind?

Dear corsarino & Simon, I do hope this date will happen, I just don't know when as I'm busy most of the summer working... Plus no money... but we'll see, who knows.

Simon: thanks for finding out these videos. What a watch! I find it very interesting that these clowns keep talking about the body being discovered by passerbys, when the historians tell us it was a call from the RB that warned of the body of Moro in Via Caetani. Besides the body was under a blanket, so how could anybody see it? This is an obvious lie "planted" on the story, either by the police or by the media directly. It is as if they want to create this fantasy, where the presence of the body was for everyone in Rome too see and witness ("the story is simple, see?") when in fact its location was as secret as everything else.

It is also deign of a shameful lying scumbag character like Vespa, as the body of Moro is still out on the streets (apparently) to ramble on about the fact that "the political forces had declared not possible to save Moro's life... because it was impossible to open a dialogue with the RB without diminishing the value of the State... the State would have lost its credibility.". Fuck off, Vespa... Immediately defending the masters (as RAI was politically under complete control of the Christian democratic party) from the obvious responsibilities (responsibilities that some old school politicians of that party, like Zaccagnini, in all fairness will take upon themselves, as someone still had ethics back then).

Besides, the credibility of the State, in Italy? What a laugh. The State, that the politicians always used and keep using for their own gain, certainly does not owns its strength to the credibility it has. It is not a "product" or an "idea" that has to be sold (but this is how they considered it, as they all had been educated by priests who had sold to them the idea of religion).
Sickening, really, especially if one re-reads the long letters wrote by Moro trying to plead for the exchange of prisoners.

All the while, the Red brigades are barely mentioned in these reports, and understandably. They were a puzzle and an empty box. The less they were discussed the better... it's always the same method after all.

[nonhocapito]

I have no idea what it means anyway I noticed a contradiction... In this video (5/11) the first "witness" is being interviewed.


full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDVxh0nVu34

He is Don Damiani, the vicar of the local Chiesa del Gesù. See around mark 4:10. Don Damiani declares that he was brought to the car by a plainclothes policeman, looked into the car whose trunk was still closed. He asked if the body "was still there", and on receiving a positive answer gave the extreme unction, "after which the artificers came" to pop open the trunk cage.

So he says, however this is apparently contradicted by this video


full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOVrxtHKnOM

...where we see, around mark 1:30, the priest getting to the car with the trunk already open, visibly giving the extreme unction at that point. While possible, it is funny he would mix up the details of this story just moments after having taken part to them.

Another element: In videos 5/11 and 6/11 lying scumbag Vespa talks about the fact that artificers had to be called because the car could be booby-trapped. For this reason, he explicitly says in video 6, they could not access the car from the side doors. However this is completely contradicted by the second video I embedded above, that shows the side doors to be pried open and perfectly accessible before the trunk was opened. So, they had the "guts" to open the side doors without fear of an explosion, but had to call the artificers (and move everyone out of the way as showed in video 5) for the sole trunk? I am not an expert in booby-traps, but does this make any sense to you? Or were "the artificers" part of a big planned psy-op, to make the discovery of the body more chilling and memorable?

[nonhocapito]

I also find very bizarre the memorial poster quickly printed by the Christian Democratic party upon learning of the death of Moro. It is showed in video 6/11. Here it is:



which translates:

Aldo Moro - Was murdered - Lives - In our hearts - His faith - In liberty

Just like Berlusconi always did and still does, we see within slogans these constant references to "liberty" and "freedom" that are really mysterious and out of context to the point of being meaningless (the second incarnation of Berlusconi's party was named "The House of Liberty", and nobody had any idea what it meant).
Here we are mourning a Christian leader, not a liberal one: if he had faith, he had faith in God, not in Liberty. At most he could have had respect or longing for freedom, but it is weird that his party buddies would miss such an occasion to underline his religious faith. Especially in a context where in fact he was deprived of personal freedom. To talk about "faith in freedom" (or liberty, as the two words overlap in italian) referring to a guy who just died in captivity sounds almost as a mockery to me. Or should we rather think at the masonic meaning of "Liberty"...?

[simonshack]

To talk about "faith in freedom" (or liberty, as the two words overlap in italian) referring to a guy who just died in captivity sounds almost as a mockery to me.[/u] Or should we rather think at the masonic meaning of "Liberty"...?

"BAPHOMET" (from Wickedpedia) :
He is therefore Life, and Love. But moreover his letter is ayin, the Eye, so that he is Light;
and his Zodiacal image is Capricornus, that leaping goat whose attribute is Liberty."

Nonho,

Please don't get me wrong now: I'm not going to 'go there' (into mysticism and masonry stuff) since I believe it is best left with the perverted morons who cultivate it. However, and having said that, it seems we DO have a bunch of perverted morons in many high offices of this world. So perhaps we can pay a little attention to their warped obsessions and symbolisms.

I'm sure you know about the meaning of 'the goat' ("Baphomet")- in masonic circles. So what exactly is this figure we see here, oddly stuck onto some corrugate aluminum construction shielding? Who do you reckon stuck these goat-shaped stickers onto these wobbly panels? Perhaps they are there just by chance - and I am a perverted moron myself for pointing them out?





And here's a picture from the official website of Gianni Giansanti (the lucky 22-year-old kid who became a world famous photographer thanks to these Moro pictures - more about him later...). I ask you: what the heck does this 'artificiere' think he's doooing?


( the Red Renault's numberplate (57686) adds up to 32 which, as far as I know, is quite a prominent masonic number. And to finish off this numerology annoyance, wickedpedia indeed mentions "11" bullets (shot through Moro's lungs) - and TV anchor Vespa always mentions "54" days (not 55) of captivity).

[nonhocapito]

I'm sure you know about the meaning of 'the goat' ("Baphomet")- in masonic circles. So what exactly is this figure we see here, oddly stuck onto some corrugate aluminum construction shielding?

Yes Simon! I had noticed the goat back in my introductory post to the case here viewtopic.php?p=2355138#p2355138
I think the goat might also stand for "scapegoat", sacrificial victim. I agree with you that the masonic interpretations are better left to the morons who believe in them... in a sense we are forced to go there only because these elements seem not to be accidental.

Even to the complete non-insiders, I think in a "Jungian" way these symbols speak, ancestrally. But that "casual" poster was probably a masonic message for someone.
Don't get me wrong, I am open to the "complete fakery" possibility for the Moro Affair... but I think Moro had died, and his body was really there: yet there is no doubt that all around his body was swirling a big cynical psy-op circus. (In the next decades, the perpetrators of such crimes might have learned exactly from cases like this one how it is better to fake the whole thing... probably the disappointed media professionals kept shaking their heads protesting that they could not make the script work unless it was better written )

As to the "artificers", they are a joke, obviously, or rather a sad enactment, to obtain the maximum shock & fear, considering the thing went live on TV...

*

As a pure speculation, and considering how in those days, especially in a country like Italy, things were far from being under complete control, it appears to me that a location like that of photographers like Giansanti, and video operators like in the 2nd video I posted above, was not considered in the original psy-op and maybe this is why it contains elements that seem to partially contradict the official story-line (car doors already open; the priest story; etc).

But how those reporters had access to a building so close to the scene of the crime, and in such a perfect position to document the event? Maybe they got lucky (possible: Rome had in those days probably the better, more unstoppable, urban photo-reporters in the world, as Fellini had documented in "La Dolce Vita") or maybe the doors to that window were open to them by some adversary group...?

[brianv]

Who is the guy with the "peak" (arrow pointing to goat just above his head), and gesturing as though someone has just pointed him out in the other?? He looks kinda familiar...and guilty!

[bostonterrierowner]

Hi everybody !

Sometimes these R4s' trunks are a bitch to open

We had a very famous political killing in 1984 in commy Poland , Popiełuszko Priest's one . It shook the nation and for sure made a 1989 "revolution" come faster. The reason I talk about this is that lots of stuff regarding Polpieluszko reminds me of Moro. Looks like very similar modus operandi , I will gather some facts(?) and post later

This story was turned into a movie " To kill a priest" by Agnieszka Holland with Ed Harris and Chris Lambert

[corsarino]

Hint n. 1:

Dalla Chiesa "era convinto che questa struttura poteva avere avuto origine sin dal periodo della resistenza, attraverso infiltrazioni nelle organizzazioni di sinistra e attraverso il controllo di alcune organizzazioni di altra tendenza". "In particolare - aveva detto Bozzo - il generale mi segnalò l'organizzazione Franchi", una organizzazione di partigiani bianchi legati ai servizi segreti americani e inglesi, della quale avevano fatto parte Edgardo Sogno e Adolfo Beria D'Argentine.

Gen. Dalla Chiesa "was convinced that this structure (RB) could have arisen since the period of resistance (1943-1945), through infiltration in the left-wing organizations and through control of some other tendency organizations." "In particular - had said Bozzo - the General advised me about Organizzazione Franchi ( Franchi Brigade)," a partisan organization linked to white Americans and British intelligence services, which had been part Edgardo Sogno and Adolfo Beria d'Argentine.

Hint n.2

Il romanzo mai scritto di Pasolini – “Petrolio” – insiste parecchio su questo aspetto, ma i riferimenti non alludono ai vari Sogno, Pacciardi o Fumagalli, tutta gente con un passato nelle Resistenzaantifascista ma anche con forti venature anticomuniste– filoamericana e filoinglese - e ancora sullacresta dell’onda negli anni Settanta perché impegnata nelle varie “crociate”. Il “Petrolio” romanzato da Pasolini è quello dell’ENI e dei due protagonisti – Bonocore e Troya – che altri non sono se non le due figure che hanno fatto la storia dell’ente petrolifero, Enrico Mattei ed Eugenio Cefis,compagni nella stessa brigata partigiana operante in Lombardia, quella cattolica e repubblicana di Alfredo di Dio.

The novel never written by Pasolini - "Oil" - insists a lot on this aspect, but allude to the various notea about Sogno, or Pacciardi or Fumagalli, all people with a background in antifascist "Resistenza" veins but also with strong pro-American and anti-filoinglese - and still in power in the seventies because they engaged in various "crusades." The "Oil" is written by Pasolini is basen on ENI and the two protagonists - Bonocore and Troya - please never though that others are not two figures who have made ​​the history of the corporate oil, and Enrico Mattei and EugenioCefis, comrades working in the same partisan brigade in Lombardy, the Catholic and republican one managed by Alfredo di Dio.

Sogno? Cefis? Sogno + Cefis ?
Actually i don't know.

[nonhocapito]

Sogno? Cefis? Sogno + Cefis ?
Actually i don't known.

I tried to read Pasolini's Petrolio a few years ago but I couldn't really enjoy it... But I'll have to re-read about Mattei...

If Mattei was pro-arab just like Moro, it only makes sense that the P2 network would take care of both... Cefis was P2 after all. Mattei and Moro both belonged to the losing part of the game.

(Who knows, maybe that same part of the game, the one that tries to affirm Italy in the Mediterranean as an open front to the arab world, is the one that has (again) lost today in Libya, now that Berlusconi has fallen into the trap, and all concessions to ENI in Libya are apparently lost...)

Forgive me if I state the obvious (maybe you corsarino are past this), but I think we probably better give Licio Gelli and the P2 the relevant role they deserve. The fact that the P2 was later burned, it doesn't mean it was irrelevant or just a front during the Moro case... Berlusconi spawned from the P2-mafia-anticommunist network after all. Sure, Licio Gelli worked for someone...
The magistrates that opened the P2 can of worms probably belonged and still belong to a different pyramid of interests, perhaps De Benedetti-Rothschilds, perhaps focused on removing from the scene of the crime the ties of the P2 to non-obvious foreign interests. Gelli and Cossiga have both in their later years mentioned the Mossad in relations to Moro (Cossiga did the same with 9/11 actually), and both have been wildly ridiculed for this by the italian "independent" comedians and commentators... Last in the list the dear boy Corrado Guzzanti... Just ideas...

But I feel that establishing the italian network is only part of the work, and probably not the more important. To keep the story within the italian borders is what all the counter-information always aimed at. Whatever the structure was (it certainly extended itself deeper than the P2 lists), however it was linked to Gladio, it could have never acted alone, nor decided the death of Moro alone and independently. I think the death/removal of Moro was decided abroad, in which case all these italian characters, like Licio Gelli or Edgardo Sogno or even Eugenio Cefis, were instrumental not to the expectations of a single italian network but to the "global order" and the order in the Mediterranean. The Moro affair was first and foremost, and despite Craxi's antics in the following decade, a major blow to the independence of Italy.

Even more importantly, the Moro Affair was also a major psy-op. Mattei's and Pasolini's murders were just murders, but Moro's was something more profound, ritual and enacted, linked in many ways to all the fakery psy-ops we deal with on this forum...

[I@N]

@nonhocapito

Dear corsarino & Simon, I do hope this date will happen, I just don't know when as I'm busy most of the summer working... Plus no money... but we'll see, who knows.

Just in case, let me know and be all my guest!

[corsarino]

The Moro Kidnapping was a psy-op.

First point: propagate the fear for the Reds (RB, le Botteghe Oscure) and the arms coming for East (the Skorpion machine-pistole).

Second point: Create a willing for a stronger State, deleting all individualism.

Third point: Destroy the motivation for a national govern (DC + PCI) and increase the separation between the two main parties.

Fourth point: Cancel the political image of Moro

There was no desire to kill Moro.

p.s. The Italian State TV filmed Via Caetani from the "Santa Lucia Fiippini" buiilding.

[bostonterrierowner]

The Moro Kidnapping was a psy-op.

First point: propagate the fear for the Reds (RB, le Botteghe Oscure) and the arms coming for East (the Skorpion machine-pistole).

Second point: Create a willing for a stronger State, deleting all individualism.

Third point: Destroy the motivation for a national govern (DC + PCI) and increase the separation between the two main parties.

Fourth point: Cancel the political image of Moro

There was no desire to kill Moro.

p.s. The Italian State TV filmed Via Caetani from the "Santa Lucia Fiippini" buiilding.

Archbishop Angelo Amato was in charge of 2010 beatification mass of priest Polpieluszko kidnapped and murdered by secret police commando in 1984 . I am open to a possibility that it was a PsyOp as well. Media attention in communist Poland given to this event was huge which is very very surprising because Popieluszko was only one of supposedly 100 murders of priests during 1981-1989 period. Popieluszko's funeral was a vast anti -commy event still peaceful , and made the whole "revolution" quicker . Now it looks to me as a stage in a controlled demolition. Why media attention ?

4 Sluzba Bezpieczenstwa officers were arrested and sentenced to long time jail time in a widely televised trial because priest's driver , by mirracle jumped off the car going 100 km/h and spoiled the beans It was later acknowledged on manistream media that Waldemar Chrostowski was an SB's asset . 1984 ,a year it all took place was still a Marschall Law period and its naive to think that somebody could have spoiled the beans through the media , let alone jumped off the car going 100 km/h and escaped on feet. Popieluszko's body was put in a trunk and later thrown into the artificial lake near the dam on Vistula river . Picture of dead popieluszko's body in a trunk was so widely rooted in people's minds that even a bad taste expression was coined " travelling in a car Popieluszko's way" meaning being thrown in a trunk I strongly suspect it was a PsyOp , very remarkable one and as powerful for polish minds as Moro's for the Italians. Why did I mention bishop Angela Amato? Amato was one of the priests offering himself to RB in Aldo Moro's stead .

[nonhocapito]

Archbishop Angelo Amato was in charge of 2010 beatification mass of priest Polpieluszko kidnapped and murdered by secret police commando in 1984 . I am open to a possibility that it was a PsyOp as well. Media attention in communist Poland given to this event was huge which is very very surprising because Popieluszko was only one of supposedly 100 murders of priests during 1981-1989 period. Popieluszko's funeral was a vast anti -commy event still peaceful , and made the whole "revolution" quicker . Now it looks to me as a stage in a controlled demolition. Why media attention ?

4 Sluzba Bezpieczenstwa officers were arrested and sentenced to long time jail time in a widely televised trial because priest's driver , by mirracle jumped off the car going 100 km/h and spoiled the beans It was later acknowledged on manistream media that Waldemar Chrostowski was an SB's asset . 1984 ,a year it all took place was still a Marschall Law period and its naive to think that somebody could have spoiled the beans through the media , let alone jumped off the car going 100 km/h and escaped on feet. Popieluszko's body was put in a trunk and later thrown into the artificial lake near the dam on Vistula river . Picture of dead popieluszko's body in a trunk was so widely rooted in people's minds that even a bad taste expression was coined " travelling in a car Popieluszko's way" meaning being thrown in a trunk I strongly suspect it was a PsyOp , very remarkable one and as powerful for polish minds as Moro's for the Italians. Why did I mention bishop Angela Amato? Amato was one of the priests offering himself to RB in Aldo Moro's stead .

This is very interesting, I especially liked the detail of the "body in the trunk". Consider that one year before the kidnapping of Moro, the Rote-Armee Fraktion http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rote_armee_fraktion, the german equivalent of the Red Brigades, kidnapped Hanns Martin Schleyer, one of the most powerful industrialists of west germany, kept him in captivity for a while, and then let his dead body to be found in the trunk of a car. (During the operation, they also managed to spill the blood over to the Palestinians by organizing the hijacking of a plane to Somalia in their name.)

In other words, the "body in the trunk" was an experimented image, probably studied to carry the most traumatizing, suffocating, ancestral and subliminal meanings best suited for such mass psy-op.

Which, obviously, also means that all these kinds of operations spawned from the same source, the same kind of super-national entity that gave the pointers to the local groups on the nature of their operations.

I am in the process of reading more on this, and sooner or later will updated this thread with more information about the background of the Moro operation, and the nature of the masonic entities in particular.

Let's just say that the P2 masonic lodge during its meetings made often reference to "international headquarters" when in doubt as to how continue a certain operation. So these very powerful groups of elitists always had the perfect conscience of being inserted inside a bigger mechanism, even though they had no specific notion on the nature of such mechanism, because of the necessary secrecy.

If you think about it, the masonic idea is pretty much the perfect tool to manipulate powerful people into doing what you want them to do, and I am sure it is still being succesfully used for that purpose. I call it the "Wizard of Oz" factor.