Thoughts on Christianity

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Thoughts on Christianity

Postby Dcopymope on December 26th, 2012, 3:27 am

The Truth About Christmas:
full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4R6_JxMU-g
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Thoughts on Christianity

Postby hoi.polloi on December 26th, 2012, 5:25 am

It is pretty strange how the tree perfectly represents the bane of the creation story with the garden of Eden - the snake, the fruit, the star or sun being more important, etc. It is also interesting to note the "significance" to some of the days - like Christmas being moved from spring to winter, copying many other celebrations or Satur(n)-day becoming less "holy" than Sun-day. But Saturn or Sun, you are talking about New Age/shamanistic/astrological study of the universe which has been going on since time immemorial.

And it's quite a tricky thing to think of Satanism and Christianity as separate religions. It seems to me a religion is a drama - a religious mythos - and when you create the 'perfect glorious good' you invent the 'perfect horrible evil' as well and you must have both to uphold each other. So, yes on the one hand Christianity and the Catholic church seem very hypocritically supporting Satanism (if they are not, in fact the same thing) but on the other hand to even distinguish them you have to believe their symbols are important and hold weight. And I am not really willing to do that.

The modern Catholic Church itself does seem to be one of the bigger problems with this world in general, but I suppose for some people it represents something good. Similarly with Satanism, I imagine. Aren't a lot of Satanists just iconoclasts pushing against overt hypocritical Christianity? Don't the real child rapists and cannibals of our world operate under extreme secrecy with whatever cloak they can find? In other words, aren't Christianity and Satanism and Atheism and Buddhism and whatever else all equally suspicious disguises for a cruel liar?

If you're not talking about identifying creeps, you are just talking about symbols. And as for all the symbol shuffling, finger pointing and so forth, doesn't it all just seem like the same thing - one big massive scramble for attention? And nobody can agree on what holds more importance and everyone claims to be in control of symbols when they're not - and isn't that the whole point of television anyway -- the control of symbols?

The idea that people are being "tricked" into worshiping something - I don't know if that's even possible, since a symbol is just that and doesn't really demand anything but attention. And certainly not something that people don't willingly or innocently put into it just by detecting a symbol with their senses. I feel as though "worship" implies conscious decision and if you're on "auto-pilot" when you're hanging up some wreath or holly and you don't understand it the same way someone else does, does that really mean you are being "tricked"? I don't think that's a good argument. I feel that argument is generally promoted by Gnostic and Masonic and other superstitious folks more than skeptics.

It's like anyone who claims they are really "revealing themselves" by dropping hints and clues "deliberately" and expecting you to unravel and adopt their personal symbolism. That's why I don't buy the pseudo-official apologist argument that the perps are "revealing themselves" through being obvious.
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Thoughts on Christianity

Postby Dcopymope on December 27th, 2012, 1:20 am

hoi.polloi wrote:It is pretty strange how the tree perfectly represents the bane of the creation story with the garden of Eden - the snake, the fruit, the star or sun being more important, etc. It is also interesting to note the "significance" to some of the days - like Christmas being moved from spring to winter, copying many other celebrations or Satur(n)-day becoming less "holy" than Sun-day. But Saturn or Sun, you are talking about New Age/shamanistic/astrological study of the universe which has been going on since time immemorial.

And it's quite a tricky thing to think of Satanism and Christianity as separate religions. It seems to me a religion is a drama - a religious mythos - and when you create the 'perfect glorious good' you invent the 'perfect horrible evil' as well and you must have both to uphold each other. So, yes on the one hand Christianity and the Catholic church seem very hypocritically supporting Satanism (if they are not, in fact the same thing) but on the other hand to even distinguish them you have to believe their symbols are important and hold weight. And I am not really willing to do that.

The modern Catholic Church itself does seem to be one of the bigger problems with this world in general, but I suppose for some people it represents something good. Similarly with Satanism, I imagine. Aren't a lot of Satanists just iconoclasts pushing against overt hypocritical Christianity? Don't the real child rapists and cannibals of our world operate under extreme secrecy with whatever cloak they can find? In other words, aren't Christianity and Satanism and Atheism and Buddhism and whatever else all equally suspicious disguises for a cruel liar?

If you're not talking about identifying creeps, you are just talking about symbols. And as for all the symbol shuffling, finger pointing and so forth, doesn't it all just seem like the same thing - one big massive scramble for attention? And nobody can agree on what holds more importance and everyone claims to be in control of symbols when they're not - and isn't that the whole point of television anyway -- the control of symbols?

The idea that people are being "tricked" into worshiping something - I don't know if that's even possible, since a symbol is just that and doesn't really demand anything but attention. And certainly not something that people don't willingly or innocently put into it just by detecting a symbol with their senses. I feel as though "worship" implies conscious decision and if you're on "auto-pilot" when you're hanging up some wreath or holly and you don't understand it the same way someone else does, does that really mean you are being "tricked"? I don't think that's a good argument.


Its the bolded text in particular I feel is worth addressing. It asks the question about the purpose of the use of symbols in propaganda. I've quoted from the book below before in the Social Engineering that answers this question, summed up in the quote below. If the propagandist is showing a pattern of using and promoting a particular symbol in their propaganda campaign, then something is meant to come of it in the future. We know what happened after Rome merged their pagan beliefs with Christianity, the carnage of the Roman Church throughout Europe. This crap may seem like it has no purpose to it for now, and henceforth some may believe, for now, that it has no effect on their psyche, that one can't be tricked into worshiping something so easily, but I'm sure this was the mindset of every German citizen when they, and their children found themselves firmly attached to the Nazi movement. It didn't even take much for it to happen.

This need of a certain cultural level to make people susceptible to propaganda is best understood if one looks at one of propaganda’s most important devices, the manipulation of symbols. The more an individual participates in the society in which he lives, the more he will cling to stereotyped symbols expressing collective notions about the past and the future of his group. The more stereotypes in a culture, the easier it is to form public opinion, and the more an individual participates in that culture, the more susceptible he becomes to the manipulation of these symbols. The number of propaganda campaigns in the West which have first taken hold in cultured settings is remarkable. This is not only true for doctrinaire propaganda, which is based on exact facts and acts on the level of the most highly developed people who have a sense of values and know a good deal about political realities, such as, for example, the propaganda on the injustice of capitalism, on economic crises, or on colonialism; it is only normal that the most educated people (intellectuals) are the first to be reached by such propaganda… All this runs counter to pat notions that only the public swallows propaganda. Naturally, the educated man does not believe in propaganda; he shrugs and is convinced that propaganda has no effect on him. This is, in fact, one of his great weaknesses, and propagandists are well aware that in order to reach someone, one must first convince him that propaganda is ineffectual and not very clever. Because he is convinced of his own superiority, the intellectual is much more vulnerable than anybody else to this maneuver.


hoi.polloi wrote:I feel that argument is generally promoted by Gnostic and Masonic and other superstitious folks more than skeptics.


You say that, but the author of the book I quoted from was a Christian, nothing but pure logic in it. I guess if someone adopts what you call a "superstition", then that makes him a non-skeptic. Technically, Christians should be the biggest skeptics on the planet. Their book tells them to test or prove all things, to hold fast to that which is good, and to abstain from all the appearance of evil. It makes perfect sense that the book would say this, as it describes a wicked force working behind the scenes, known as Satan, this force the Gnostics and Masons worship, who is well understood as the master deceiver. And this world is full of deception, isn't it?
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby hoi.polloi on December 27th, 2012, 3:55 am

I agree about the use of symbols in propaganda, but what I'm saying is that everyone I've talked to about this subject is more than capable of confronting and disregarding the mind control they want to get rid of. The problem I think comes when one encounters the average person's stubborn and willing adhesion to symbols that are marching them into a barracks or something. People will just not let go - and this is no more deception than it is self-deception or even ignorance. Agreements are a two-way road.

Continuing the example of the Nazi movement, if a spiritual-populist Super-State Religion were imposed on a people (I would argue most television programs embody the virtual rites of this Super-State Religion) and people continued to go with it, it is not just the leaders that are to blame. Every single person is complicit in agreeing with the concepts and presumptions of the symbols to enable the "movement" to achieve its evils. Equally complicit? Probably not. I am not saying everyone should be given the same blanket treatment, but I do find it difficult to simply pardon all people unconditionally if they are involved in choosing a negative world view and then acting on it and creating the negative world. It is not the sole fault of the propagandists if the audience itself is endorsing and becoming excited by antisocial behavior. It's a terrible partnership. But none of us is capable of being ultimate judge and I will enforce that we leave room for awakening to people's innocence in succumbing to hucksters. We can't claim everyone is guilty or sold their soul or something. We can only complain about our personal treatment. We can't even organize on this site; it's not fit for creating social movements in the physical world. It is merely a sort of scientific skeptical forum - almost the exact opposite of a cult (cults exist specifically to undermine skepticism and critical thinking).

And no, to answer your guess about my opinion, I wouldn't say Religious people are incapable of being skeptics. On the contrary, everyone has their own personal Religion, skeptics just as much. But this forum is not for discussing personal ideas about the nature of existence. The personal answers we make to the question "why?" are just that. So if the center of the argument here is whether a supernatural being (identified at least at one time as Satan) exists today and is working against humanity, we cannot make room on our forum for such a precept. This would lead to incredible speculations and dives into the realm of personal spiritual experiences. We aren't really organized around that concept. This forum exists primarily to question what are lies in our immediate media culture. The nature (moral or otherwise) of those lies (and whether they are evil or innocent) must be left to personal decisions. We can't tell people what to think and I for one refuse to on a forum that prides itself on liberating the mind to identify elsewhere from the deceptive media what is Truth.
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby Gracist on January 24th, 2013, 9:06 pm

Wow great video, thanks for sharing. I try reading those Bible verses to Christian friends, and they just shrug it off, because they are so emotionally attached to the Christmas ritual. I also think it is interesting how people talk about "getting into the Christmas SPIRIT." Even after all of these things combined, the anagram of Santa/Satan, the sun symbols, the very Bible verses which tell Christians they shouldn't be participating in these rituals, WHY is it so hard to make them SEE. I feel so alone and sad sometimes when in my daily life I can't find people who can understand, and all around me they "deck the halls" and pile presents under the trees. I hate to be sad around the cheerful people, but I really want to lead a Biblical life. Well, thanks again for spreading the information. :)

Also, if you could, is there more good information on the Saturnalia festival and how Christ wasn't born in December etc. I really think this topic can fall under the scope of media deceptions, because there is so much media influence on celebrating the "Holydays", and the manufactured fight between secular society and Christians around the Christmas season.
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby Gracist on January 24th, 2013, 9:22 pm

One also mustn't forget this little "joke"


full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5KDRBzUBJI

When I first saw this, I thought it was just a mockery of Christmas. Now that I know more about the Christmas deception, I see this video more as an honest declaration that Christmas is indeed a Satanic Holy Day.
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby Dcopymope on January 10th, 2014, 3:35 pm

Gracist wrote:One also mustn't forget this little "joke"


full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5KDRBzUBJI

When I first saw this, I thought it was just a mockery of Christmas. Now that I know more about the Christmas deception, I see this video more as an honest declaration that Christmas is indeed a Satanic Holy Day.


Apollyon Rising: Satanic Temple unveils Santa's true identity:

full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdFs_gku-Ug

Maybe this statue will suffer the same fate as the statue of Dagon did in 1 Samuel 5 when the Philistines put the ark of God in the temple of Dagon? Maybe, maybe not, but the obvious message from that part of scripture is that God will not be mocked, and as far as I know, Baphomet, or Santa Clause as he's called on Christmas has nothing at all to do with the history of the state of Oklahoma. They might as well just erect a statue for Adolf Hitler or Aleister Crowley while they are at it.

And the Philistines took the ark of God, and brought it from Ebenezer unto Ashdod.

2 When the Philistines took the ark of God, they brought it into the house of Dagon, and set it by Dagon.

3 And when they of Ashdod arose early on the morrow, behold, Dagon was fallen upon his face to the earth before the ark of the Lord. And they took Dagon, and set him in his place again.

4 And when they arose early on the morrow morning, behold, Dagon was fallen upon his face to the ground before the ark of the Lord; and the head of Dagon and both the palms of his hands were cut off upon the threshold; only the stump of Dagon was left to him. - 1 Samuel 5


Lets hope this Baphomet statue gets vandalized as well if they do get it approved. It should be noted that king Nimrod of the Bible was also said to have worn horns on his head as a crown.
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby bostonterrierowner on January 10th, 2014, 5:47 pm

Dear Dcopymope,

I hate to spoil your party but Baphomet/Goat of Mendez is.... You, me , and every unenlightened man :)

"...This is what it symbolizes, a beast driven by its urges, desires and materialism etc.

As the sixth letter of the Hebrew alphabet, Vav, expresses the struggle between the passions and conscience, the antagonism of ideas, so the eighteenth letter, VV, which is three times six or 666, represents the "beast" which we read of in Revelation, the Adam man. On the mental plane we use the expression He Phren, for this number, the lower mind, the material mind. In astronomy the affinity of this letter (6) is the bull (Taurus). Mankind, living wholly on the material plane, is hence a beast - physically, mentally and emotionally. The Animal on three planes. Thus in the Tarot we find that 18 represents "Antagonism." - God man

The number of man is 666, the beast spoke of is man (the lower mind, not the enlightened soul, without ILLUMINATION)...."

Above text is not mine , it was e-mailed to me by once-a-member of CF around one year ago. I like it and now I am sharing it.

Admins:

Do we really have to be exposed to Dcopymope religious fanatism and bigotry ?

Dcopymope: Can you stick to media fakery research on CF and find some bible hugging forum to dump your religious bullshit on ? :)

Are you some kind of Spanish Inquisitor's incarnate ? :puke:
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby brianv on January 10th, 2014, 6:10 pm

Hahaha - oh dear! I hit this thread by accident.

Why is this clown allowed to spew numpty beliefs on this forum? Can you export this, and any similar threads, to the dicke forum!
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby Dcopymope on January 10th, 2014, 8:17 pm

bostonterrierowner wrote:Dear Dcopymope,

I hate to spoil your party but Baphomet/Goat of Mendez is.... You, me , and every unenlightened man :)

"...This is what it symbolizes, a beast driven by its urges, desires and materialism etc.

As the sixth letter of the Hebrew alphabet, Vav, expresses the struggle between the passions and conscience, the antagonism of ideas, so the eighteenth letter, VV, which is three times six or 666, represents the "beast" which we read of in Revelation, the Adam man. On the mental plane we use the expression He Phren, for this number, the lower mind, the material mind. In astronomy the affinity of this letter (6) is the bull (Taurus). Mankind, living wholly on the material plane, is hence a beast - physically, mentally and emotionally. The Animal on three planes. Thus in the Tarot we find that 18 represents "Antagonism." - God man

The number of man is 666, the beast spoke of is man (the lower mind, not the enlightened soul, without ILLUMINATION)...."

Above text is not mine , it was e-mailed to me by once-a-member of CF around one year ago. I like it and now I am sharing it.

Admins:

Do we really have to be exposed to Dcopymope religious fanatism and bigotry ?

Dcopymope: Can you stick to media fakery research on CF and find some bible hugging forum to dump your religious bullshit on ? :)

Are you some kind of Spanish Inquisitor's incarnate ? :puke:


So this is the extent of your research on this matter? Somebody spouting off a bunch of numbers? Whoever this individual is you claim you got it from, I see no relation to this text to the worship of Baphomet. Goats were used by the Israelite's as an atonement for sin. Its the custom of the scapegoat. Bephomet is meant to be a mockery of Jesus as the sacrificial lamb. The horned hand symbol that we see being flashed by anybody of any real influence in the world is akin to flipping the bird, or the middle finger at Jesus. That's why the goats head are revered in satanism and witchcraft, for the attainment of "knowledge".

Bephomet being portrayed with his right arm up and the left arm down is meant to be symbolic of the union of the masculine and the feminine, or the law of opposites combined. Its just like other ancient symbols like the square and compass of freemasonry (the compass being the masculine and the square representing the feminine), the Chinese yin-yang symbol and so forth. The true meaning of this "law of opposites" as they call it is exposed in the Genesis 6 story. To put it simply, the right arm means "Sons of God" and the left arm means "daughters of men". Henceforth, the compass represents the fallen angels and the square represents the women in which the angels mated with, or raped. Once you understand this, then you'll see what the individual at the 6:40 mark of the video was really talking about.

"historical marker commemorating scapegoats, the marginalized and the demonized minority, the unjustly outcast.


From what I can see, the only group that have been "demonized" and made into a minority in America are Christians.The "unjustly outcast" he's really referring to are the fallen angels that were cast out and chained up in outer darkness for the crime of Genesis 6. Got it?
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby Dcopymope on January 10th, 2014, 10:12 pm

Satanists Unveil 7-Foot Baphomet Statue For City's Capitol:
full link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVoTpGD9KB8

Mark Dice pretty much sums it up:
What the silly Satanists don't understand is that the 10 Commandments are a historical reference to our current system of laws...ya know like not allowing murder, theft, lying under oath...etc. Brain damaged satanists don't know anything about history or much of anything for that matter, so we should't expect them to "get" why the 10 Commandments sit outside of courthouses. P.S. Aleister Crowley ate his own feces in his quest for enlightenment. Have fun!
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby bostonterrierowner on January 10th, 2014, 10:38 pm

One hand up, one hand down means as above so below. This esoteric principle says that a human body is a universe that reflects universe above. As you can see Baphomet carries both masculine and feminine features which means he/she is an androgynous creature . Two horns represent most probably duality ( ying yang, adam eve , good evil , up down , etc.) . Goat's and sometimes bull's head symbolize the lower brain responsible for human urges . 666 refers to carbon or a cube ( flat cube is a cross ). Human flesh is mainly carbon, the cube is a platonic figure representing earth.

This is a story about us, mortal humans, with earth and our bodies being the cross we are crucified on :)

Stop with this Jesus thing . It's just a zodiac story just like King Arthur and the round table.

If you want to fight Baphomet, start from yourself. Control your urges,fanatism, materialism and you will save your soul. Jesus story is about saving us from ourselves.
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby Dcopymope on January 10th, 2014, 11:21 pm

bostonterrierowner wrote:One hand up, one hand down means as above so below. This esoteric principle says that a human body is a universe that reflects universe above. As you can see Baphomet carries both masculine and feminine features which means he/she is an androgynous creature . Two horns represent most probably duality ( ying yang, adam eve , good evil , up down , etc.) . Goat's and sometimes bull's head symbolize the lower brain responsible for human urges . 666 refers to carbon or a cube ( flat cube is a cross ). Human flesh is mainly carbon, the cube is a platonic figure representing earth.

This is a story about us, mortal humans, with earth and our bodies being the cross we are crucified on :)

Stop with this Jesus thing . It's just a zodiac story just like King Arthur and the round table.

If you want to fight Baphomet, start from yourself. Control your urges,fanatism, materialism and you will save your soul. Jesus story is about saving us from ourselves.


As for your claim of the story of Jesus being a representation of some unnamed zodiac, of all the criticisms of the Bible, the copy cat thesis is the most debunked as it has no credibility to it whatsoever, and that's why Christian scholars waste very little time with those who to come to them with these accusations of plagiarism. Mentioning this only does more to discredit your competence as a researcher more than anything else you have to say about the Bible. Such nonsense was believed by many, including me, it turned out to be the easiest criticism to debunk out of all of them even with just a modicum of real research. Anybody with any degree of competence in research can debunk Zeitgeist, the film that popularized the copy cat theory back in 2007. Here is a link to one such site that systemically debunked each and every accusation that was made in the film. The text in green are quotes from the film.

Link: http://conspiracies.skepticproject.com/articles/zeitgeist/part-one/#the_zodiac

The Zodiac

This is the cross of the Zodiac, one of the oldest conceptual images in human history. It reflects the sun as it figuratively passes through the 12 major constellations over the course of a year. It also reflects the 12 months of the year, the 4 seasons, and the solstices and equinoxes . The term Zodiac relates to the fact that constellations were anthropomorphized, or personified, as figures, or animals.

The above statement implies that constellations and the zodiac have always been connected -- and that there have been just twelve. While the zodiac's exact origins are unknown, the oldest known zodiacs do not have exactly 12 signs and thus conclusions drawn to this cannot be trusted. For example, the Babylonian zodiac originally consisted of 18 signs [1b] and the Mayan Zodiac consisted of 20 [2]. While the Egyptian and Greek zodiacs do contain 12 signs, I thought it important to mention that the 12 signs are not some undeniable truth that can easily be recognized by all civilizations. In fact there are actually 13 constellations the sun passes through, the missing one is Ophiuchus, which is not counted by modern astrologers, for some reason[2b].

In other words, the early civilizations did not just follow the sun and stars, they personified them with elaborate myths involving their movements and relationships. The sun, with its life-giving and -saving qualities was personified as a representative of the unseen creator or god. It was known as "God's Sun," the light of the world, the savior of human kind. Likewise, the 12 constellations represented places of travel for God's Sun and were identified by names, usually representing elements of nature that happened during that period of time. For example, Aquarius, the water bearer, who brings the Spring rains.

The sun was not the creator god in all cultures, but rather only a few. While the sun was widely worshipped, more often than not, most religions believed the earth was given birth to (along side the sun and moon) by a different god, or even in one case the Earth is the back of a giant turtle. This is hardly something that can be seen through most religions, and is a bit of a stretch[2c]. The whole purpose of saying "God's Sun, the light of the world, the savior of human kind", is to setup for a comparison for Jesus, and as I will explain later on in this article, is completely inaccurate.

And something else further makes little sense here, if the sun itself is God and the creator, why would they refer to it as "God's Sun", implying that the sun is not the God? Also as I mention at the bottom of this article, there was a a segment cut out that said "God's Sun = God's Son", and this is also inaccurate, because they are similar only in English -- and the bible was not written in English. I feel like this part is still a setup because it is still implying that God's Sun is the same as God's Son, even though the connection is impossible.


Connections Between the Bible and the Zodiac

Now, of the many astrological-astronomical metaphors in the Bible, one of the most important has to do with the ages. Throughout the scripture there are numerous references to the "Age." In order to understand this, we need to be familiar with the phenomenon known as the precession of the equinoxes. The ancient Egyptians along with cultures long before them recognized that approximately every 2150 years the sunrise on the morning of the spring equinox would occur at a different sign of the Zodiac. This has to do with a slow angular wobble that the Earth maintains as it rotates on it's axis. It is called a precession because the constellations go backwards, rather than through the normal yearly cycle. The amount of time that it takes for the precession to go through all 12 signs is roughly 25,765 years. This is also called the "Great Year," and ancient societies were very aware of this. They referred to each 2150 year period as an "age." From 4300 b.c. to 2150 b.c., it was the Age of Taurus, the Bull. From 2150 b.c. to 1 a.d., it was the Age of Aries, the Ram, and from 1 a.d. to 2150 a.d. it is the Age of Pisces, the age we are still in to this day, and in and around 2150, we will enter the new age: the Age of Aquarius.

Now that the film maker has lead the watcher into a certain mindset, it is time to kick it up a notch. The film maker claims there are many "astrological-astronomical metaphors" in the Bible, but provides no evidence to back this up. He then goes on to talk about how age is really a metaphor for the astrological ages such as Aries and Pisces. There is absolutely no evidence to suggest such, and we will discuss this further in a bit. It makes various claims about the zodiac and the length of ages, while these claims are not necessarily inaccurate, they prove very little when discussing the Bible.

The Ages

Now, the Bible reflects, broadly speaking, a symbolic movement through 3 ages, while foreshadowing a 4th. In the Old Testament when Moses comes down Mount Sinai with the 10 Commandments, he is very upset to see his people worshiping a golden bull calf. In fact, he shattered the stone tablets and instructed his people to kill each other in order to purify themselves. Most Biblical scholars would attribute this anger to the fact that the Israelites were worshiping a false idol, or something to that effect. The reality is that the golden bull is Taurus the Bull, and Moses represents the new Age of Aries the Ram. This is why Jews even today still blow the Ram's horn. Moses represents the new Age of Aries, and upon the new age, everyone must shed the old age. Other deities mark these transitions as well, a pre-Christian god who kills the bull, in the same symbology.


The film maker discusses that Moses came down from Mount Sinai with this 10 commandments and smashed them because he saw his people worshipping a bull, but in reality that bull was Taurus. According to the film, Moses represents the new age of Aries, and that's why Moses was angry. It goes on to say that because Moses represents Aries the ram, that is why Jews blow the ram's horn. It is far more likely that the reason Jews use the ram's horn is because they raised sheep, and a horn can be easily made into an instrument [51]. These claims cannot be substantiated with history either, primarily because the movie says the age Aries was from 2150 BC to 1 AD, however the earliest dates given by scholars for Exodus does not place it until over 650 years after the Age began [52], a little late for Moses to start a new age and get angry that nobody else had caught on.

Jesus Fish

Now Jesus is the figure who ushers in the age following Aries, the Age of Pisces the Two Fish. Fish symbolism is very abundant in the New Testament. Jesus feeds 5,000 people with bread and "2 fish." When he begins his ministry walking along Galilei, he befriends 2 fisherman, who follow him. And I think we've all seen the Jesus-fish on the backs of people's cars. Little do they know what it actually means. It is a Pagan astrological symbolism for the Sun's Kingdom during the Age of Pisces. Also, Jesus' assumed birth date is essentially the start of this age.


Just like with Moses we run into various problems with the claims stated in the film. The Age of Pisces is represented by two fish, but the film maker chooses his words carefully. He gleefully mentions that Jesus fed 5,000 people with 2 fish, but he chooses not to mention the amount of bread. The passage in the Bible says "We only have five loaves of bread and two fish". [53] The reason he does not mention the amount of bread is so that the parallel between the zodiac and the bible fits. It also is not out of the ordinary that fish is mentioned, it was a very common food staple in the region. Therefore, if someone were to have food, it would have probably been bread and fish.

It goes on to say that the fish symbol on the back of people's cars is actually a pagan astrological symbol for the "Sun's Kingdom during the Age of Pisces". However, the true meaning behind the fish does not fit the parallel with the zodiac they are trying to make. The fact is the ancient and classical Greek word for fish is "ΙΧΘΥΣ" which is also an acronym for "Ιησους Χριστος Θεου Υιος Σωτηρ" or "Jesus Christ God's Son is Savior" [54].

Passover

At Luke 22:10 when Jesus is asked by his disciples where the next passover will be after he is gone, Jesus replied: "Behold, when ye are entered into the city, there shall a man meet you bearing a pitcher of water... follow him into the house where he entereth in." This scripture is by far one of the most revealing of all the astrological references. The man bearing a pitcher of water is Aquarius, the water-bearer, who is always pictured as a man pouring out a pitcher of water. He represents the age after Pisces, and when the Sun (God's Sun) leaves the Age of Pisces (Jesus), it will go into the House of Aquarius, as Aquarius follows Pisces in the precession of the equinoxes. Also Jesus is saying is that after the Age of Pisces will come the Age of Aquarius.


The film talks about a passage in the Bible and claims it is "by far one of the most revealing of all the astrological references." The problem here is it does not reveal anything except that the film maker has completely misquoted the Bible. While the reply from Jesus is correct, the question the disciples ask is not. The film maker claims that the man bearing the pitcher that Jesus is talking about, actually symbolizes the Age of Aquarius. Luke 22:10 is accurately quoted [55], but let's take a closer look at the disciples' question.

Like 22:7-9 states the following: "Then came the first day of Unleavened Bread on which the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed [56]. And Jesus sent Peter and John, saying, 'Go and prepare the Passover for us, so that we may eat it.' [57] They said to Him, 'Where do You want us to prepare it?' [58]".

As stated above, the disciples are not asking about where the next Passover will be, but rather where they would be eating that night. Aside from that though, the symbolism put forth by the movie is also inaccurate. The movie describes Aquarius as "always pictured as a man pouring out a pitcher of water", however in the passage from the Bible, the man is not pouring the water, but carrying it. If is the symbolic reference that the movie claims, why is the symbolism incorrect?

Revelation and the Ages

Now, we have all heard about the end times and the end of the world. Apart from the cartoonish depictions in the Book of Revelation, the main source of this idea comes from Matthew 28:20, where Jesus says "I will be with you even to the end of the world." However, in King James Version, "world" is a mistranslation, among many mistranslations. The actual word being used is "aeon", which means "age." "I will be with you even to the end of the age." Which is true, as Jesus' Solar Piscean personification will end when the Sun enters the Age of Aquarius. The entire concept of end times and the end of the world is a misinterpreted astrological allegory. Let's tell that to the approximately 100 million people in America who believe the end of the world is coming.


The movie makes claims that the King James Version of the Bible has many mistranslations, such as the word "world" is really "aeon" which means "age". If the King James Version is so incorrect, why are they using it? The only possible reason would be to make a more general attack on the reliability of the translation or so that they can spin words and "mistranslations" however they please. While the word for "world" actually is the word "aion" it is the Greek word "αιων" [59] which actually means "eternity", not "age", which is something like "παλαιώνω" [60]. So, essentially it is communicating the general idea correctly "even to the end of the world", "even to the end of eternity".

I think it is interesting how the film maker dismisses the Book of Revelation as "cartoonish depictions", even though it contains the majority of the end time predictions. It is no doubt because he could not draw a parallel between the zodiac and Revelation, only with Matthew 28. All of the film maker's Biblical arguments work this way, he selects what agrees with him, but ignores everything else. The film maker also claims that Matthew 28 is the "main source" for Christian knowledge of the end times. Passages in Matthew 24 [61], 2nd Thessalonians 2 [62], the book of Daniel [62-1], and of course Revelation [63a] are far better sources, but they do not contain the parallels that the film maker wanted to make, so they are ignored. Let's not forget that the King James Bible has 31,102 verses in it[63b], and yet only a few are about the astrological connections between Jesus, God, the Zodiac, and so forth? If the book is an astrological document, one would figure there'd be more.


You might also want to check out a book called "The Case for the real Jesus" by Lee Strobel, former journalist for the Chicago Tribune and former atheist turned Christian. He investigates the most recent and widespread attacks on the Bible, yours being one, and its the silliest accusation of them all.
Dcopymope
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby fbenario on January 11th, 2014, 3:40 am

Dcopymope wrote:From what I can see, the only group that have been "demonized" and made into a minority in America are Christians.

You don't think Muslims have been demonized in America?
fbenario
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Re: The Truth About Christmas

Postby fbenario on January 11th, 2014, 3:44 am

Dcopymope wrote:You might also want to check out a book called "The Case for the real Jesus" by Lee Strobel, former journalist for the Chicago Tribune and former atheist turned Christian. He investigates the most recent and widespread attacks on the Bible, yours being one, and its the silliest accusation of them all.

After 45 years of very loud and argumentative non-belief, I read Strobel's The Case For Christ. By the end of the book I believed, and was baptized 2 days later.
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